Experimental Hair Loss Options

[freeflow]

Anyone try topical ginger extract or ginger shampoo?

Whats the mechanism behind ginger? We could probably rub some raw ginger on the scalp during shower then wash it off.

 

[TubZy]

Anyone try topical ginger extract or ginger shampoo?

Whats the mechanism behind ginger? We could probably rub some raw ginger on the scalp during shower then wash it off.

Many mechanisms but someone mentioned they stopped their shedding with ginger shampoo, there are also many logs from other sites claiming topical ginger did the same, im guessing anti inflammatory unless ginger interacts with mineral balance some how

 

[Aleksandr]

Anyone try topical ginger extract or ginger shampoo?

Whats the mechanism behind ginger? We could probably rub some raw ginger on the scalp during shower then wash it off.

Many mechanisms but someone mentioned they stopped their shedding with ginger shampoo, there are also many logs from other sites claiming topical ginger did the same, im guessing anti inflammatory unless ginger interacts with mineral balance some how

In TCM its supposed to promote blood flow

 

[Miggie]

I have been using the polysorbate 80 for around 3 weeks now. I only apply it like 2 times a week tops. And at first i noticed a lot of hair which where stuck because its so sticky but the hair texture seems better. I also have a lot of small vellus hairs around the temples and now they are a lot darker, still fine tho. Its an improvement so I will keep this up and report back in a few more weeks.

 

[JonnyCraig]

Hey @JonnyCraig

I megadosed on B5 for at least a few months too years ago and that was when I first noticed shedding. Hair quality has been declining since then but it's hard to differentiate from natural aging. Recently tried the zing/manganese, and thorne extras, but felt shitty on them. Gbol recommended that I take copper (I had low WBC and high TSH in my latest labs), and I have been feeling good and noticed a cut in shedding. I stopped all other supplements and now just take 2mg copper, some Taurine and MSM daily. I wonder how the contrarian endocrinology plays into this since I'm feeling good from copper.

I tried the Polysorbate 80 for a few weeks with high hopes but instead noticed only a hefty increase in shedding. Also my hair was constantly stripped of natural oils so the benefit of no-poo for hair texture was abated. There's a chance that the shedding was in fact a sign of P80 working and those were all hairs that would grow back stronger, but as the shed continued daily for 3 weeks I eventually gave up. Now I'm off and shedding is back down. I also read that it's estrogenic when applied topically (there's a study on rats for this), but the P80 crew over at RPF shot down any slander against this magic (snake?) oil.

What was your TSH? I had 4.23 ! (high also)

2mg copper eh... interesting! I guess I should try that!

What is the reasoning behind taking the copper vs the zinc+manganese?

You're likely zinc heavy?

Did you have shedding on zinc+manganese? or you just felt bad in general?

EDIT: Just ordered Copper 2mg

Would appreciate if someone could further explain why this would be good.

Gbol you around dude?

 

[tfcjesse]

What was your TSH? I had 4.23 ! (high also)

2mg copper eh... interesting! I guess I should try that!

What is the reasoning behind taking the copper vs the zinc+manganese?

You're likely zinc heavy?

Did you have shedding on zinc+manganese? or you just felt bad in general?

EDIT: Just ordered Copper 2mg

Would appreciate if someone could further explain why this would be good.

Gbol you around dude?

TSH was 2.0. He recommended copper after I showed him my labs and mentioned my low WBC/high TSH. He said those were commonly seen in people with low copper.

I've been taking zinc for a while so I'm not sure how to associate shedding with it, but I seem to have less shedding on copper. Almost no itch.

I've also seen gbol recommend a mixture of copper, calcium, magnesium, zinc, manganese. Then again it might have been matty b, sometimes I get the names confused when reading the walls of text. Either way I'm waiting for the hair test to dial stuff in and I'll do some more blood labs in a few weeks to see how the copper supplement is changing things.

 

[TubZy]

Another interesting thing I came across was he shou wu. It heavily interacts with potassium (seems to lower it) as [mention]gbolduev[/mention] mentioned that hair loss and growth depends on potassium in the cell.

He shou wu is known for darkening and regrowing hair when used orally/topically (topically would be more effective) ...anyone try?

https://www.healthline.com/health/fo-ti-cure-to-old-age#overview1

 

[jacknap]

Another interesting thing I came across was he shou wu. It heavily interacts with potassium (seems to lower it) as @gbolduev mentioned that hair loss and growth depends on potassium in the cell.

He shou wu is known for darkening and regrowing hair when used orally/topically (topically would be more effective) ...anyone try?

https://www.healthline.com/health/fo-ti-cure-to-old-age#overview1

my looks great and i cycle it but could be the millions of other things im doing too.

 

[JonnyCraig]

What was your TSH? I had 4.23 ! (high also)

2mg copper eh... interesting! I guess I should try that!

What is the reasoning behind taking the copper vs the zinc+manganese?

You're likely zinc heavy?

Did you have shedding on zinc+manganese? or you just felt bad in general?

EDIT: Just ordered Copper 2mg

Would appreciate if someone could further explain why this would be good.

Gbol you around dude?

TSH was 2.0. He recommended copper after I showed him my labs and mentioned my low WBC/high TSH. He said those were commonly seen in people with low copper.

I've been taking zinc for a while so I'm not sure how to associate shedding with it, but I seem to have less shedding on copper. Almost no itch.

I've also seen gbol recommend a mixture of copper, calcium, magnesium, zinc, manganese. Then again it might have been matty b, sometimes I get the names confused when reading the walls of text. Either way I'm waiting for the hair test to dial stuff in and I'll do some more blood labs in a few weeks to see how the copper supplement is changing things.

Thanks.

I am now doing 2mg copper per night. Stopped Manganese/Zinc.

Should I... be doing all 3?

 

[tfcjesse]

Thanks.

I am now doing 2mg copper per night. Stopped Manganese/Zinc.

Should I... be doing all 3?

Haha well as best as I can tell, copper/calcium for fast oxidizers and zing/mang for slow. But of course, this is pretty vague and two strict oxidization types has been argued against here.

Do you have any idea which type you may be, or any abnormalities in your blood work?

I think the stuff Travis is researching is pretty interesting. Spiro/cyclosporine topically as MR antagonists. I know for certain a few people have regrown full heads of hair with spiro but it has nasty anti-androgen effects taken orally.

 

[JonnyCraig]

http://www.arltma.com/Articles/HairLossDoc.htm

Reading up on just how important copper is for hair! Very interesting stuff

I used to take Zinc Picolinate at 50mg/100mg doses per day for the longest time.. on and off over the years, never using copper.

 

[hello]

http://www.arltma.com/Articles/HairLossDoc.htm

Reading up on just how important copper is for hair! Very interesting stuff

I used to take Zinc Picolinate at 50mg/100mg doses per day for the longest time.. on and off over the years, never using copper.

Thank you, interesting !
I am kind of deficient in both zinc and cooper .
Take a look at my thread : http://www.hackstasis.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=166

 

[jacknap]

retin-a i believe is proven effective for hair loss as well as great skin.

i used to use it before i crashed but binned it just to be safe for my liver.

might start running it again as i'm doing way better. the .1 is too strong tho imo i like the .5

 

[JonnyCraig]

Thanks All, let's keep the comments coming.

I am now going to be taking 2mg copper before bed, then 22mg zinc/10mg manganese/10,000iu vitamin a (retinic acid) during the day.

Based on this, from gbold:

"Hairloss is either from protein wasting or from alkalosis, which makes your calcium become not ionized.
Zinc converts CO2 into bicarbonate to transport in venous blood. This is why androgenic alopecia always involves zinc deficiency. Copper puts calcium inside of the cell, since copper is part of cytochrome with the production of CO2, carbohydrate metabolism. Manganese lowers calcium in the cell and increase iron bioavailability. No iron bioavailability no hair. and grey hair. Zinc manganese will stop hairloss and will reverse grey hair. grey beards.

Zinc lowers manganese. low manganese does not allow iron to work. LOW IRON lowers enzyme catalase, this is why you get grey hairs. If you took a lot of zinc, you will need to take copper with manganese with zinc and vitamin A"

 

[tfcjesse]

Keep us posted on how that combo works for you [mention]JonnyCraig[/mention].

Not to derail the thread, but I have always been on the fence about topical retin-a on the skin. I know it was touted as a godsend for anti-aging/anti-wrinkle and glowing skin, but I have also read that it worsened people's eye area and gave them less quality facial skin overall. Anyone have anecdotal experience for topical tretinoin/retin-a? My hair is too long to apply it to my scalp :|

 

[Scenes]

[mention]brix[/mention]

Any update on the copper/calcium for your hair?

 

[JonnyCraig]

Keep us posted on how that combo works for you @JonnyCraig.

Not to derail the thread, but I have always been on the fence about topical retin-a on the skin. I know it was touted as a godsend for anti-aging/anti-wrinkle and glowing skin, but I have also read that it worsened people's eye area and gave them less quality facial skin overall. Anyone have anecdotal experience for topical tretinoin/retin-a? My hair is too long to apply it to my scalp :|

Regarding retin-a (tretinoin) I have bought tubes of it back in the day (to use both on skin and on scalp) but never went through with it. On face... I've heard multiple reports of it making people worse, although there are some people who swear by it. I didn't want to chance it. Same for scalp really...

 

[JonnyCraig]

This is actress Kristen Wiig.. (SNL, and did a few movies)

Kind of surprising considering I always thought she had quite great hair...

Wonder why her hair is thinning out so bad.. I know a lot of females have issues with iron.

 

[Noodle]

[mention]JonnyCraig[/mention]
I think women will get MPB too after they hit Menopause.
You can see lots of women getting bigger temples when getting older.

Gbolduev said that you will need iron available to grow hair.
Maybe with loosing blood, iron will be kept low and available.
And as soon that does not longer happen, they start to experience the same as men. It just starts way later.

 

[Aleksandr]

Dunno, my gf always tests low in iron for blood and her hair test showed low iron too. she's got a mega mane, thick, long and no recession at all