I will not lose

[P_stashio]

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[Canari]

Clouds are there, imagine the sun is behind them. When I feel bad, I connect to my little chisp of sun in my heart, I know it is there behind the crapish feeling. I live in a place worse than you for having tests! But I ordered the hair test. Have you done it?

Yes this is true, if I guess what you feel: you do not trust what this doctor told you, and it makes you hold back. You also did not feel you where humanly treated, only your syndrome was looked at, and too quickly. Loosing trust and hope. Feeling stuck. you want to do something, but you do not want to make a mistake. Hesitating. This is normal to feel like this after what you tell us about this doctor, and most doctors who would really help, they do it differently! Don't you feel angry? I do feel angry when I read about this experience!

The best you can do now is to build close human relationships with friends. Do not care about solving your health issues right now. Find people to whom you can say what happened, but tell it is this terms: how did you feel, how do you feel. Do not be ashame of any reaction you will have, because they will be the reaction your body will choose to untighten the body contraction you probably have from feeling stuck. When I do this, usually suddenly I find the situation so crazy that I start laughing, and then also some tears come out. If I let it happen, then I sigh or even yawn, and then I am me again. All this is physical but we are made ashame of it!

According to the people I am with, I can also start to tell events in a crazy exaggerated way. Most people don't know how to support emotions, but you can always trigger humour and laughing and jokes. You can lie and exaggerate things if necessary, go according to the abuse you feel more than the real facts. When you will laugh and expel your real emotions, people will not even notice it!

I love the video of this young guy stuttering and being such a big humorist, in American got talents. Any comic is also helping to feel better. And honestly, when I feel isolated, I watch those videos of AGT or the british and russian and more, but some countries do not show emotions... I watch the wonderful performances that shocked judges to tears... I love to share that humans are wonderful.

 

[IHateFin]

Well boys I’m losing hope.

Talked to dr. Crisler and he recommended low dose clomid for 3 months. But that goes against a ton of shit I have seen him post about before about how he handles PFS. He really didn’t seem to look at my labs or anything. Just seemed like a cookie cutter approach.

It’s so hard to get any tests done here in Canada. I don’t know where to turn. I have a hormone profile like a guy whose abused a crap ton of steroids and all I did was try a drug for a month.

I feel like total shit most days. Not sure what to do here.

Don't worry bro there are SO many better protocols to try that make clomid therapy pale in comparison. If I were you I would get some ru486 and run a very short 3 day low dose cycle of around 25mg.

A lot of us here, myself included, have given up on doctors and pharmaceuticals so we usually all self medicate. We got some very intelligent lads on this forum so I'm sure they will chime in shortly, but in my opinion clomid won't do shit. Especially low dose. You need to focus on decreasing progesterone and increasing estrogen and dht. Clomid will not do any of this and once clomid is eliminated from your body you're back at square one. I don't know a single person who simply got cured from clomid alone.

If you can't run ru486 try Ella or even mediherb tribulous. You need to tank progesterone and potassium and allow estrogen to rise to allow dht to come back unopposed from progesterone.

 

[P_stashio]

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[IHateFin]

I really don’t get the science behind this mans I supposedly already have high estrogen? Not really sure what to make of it.

I haven’t even got progestin tested yet either. And I also have high DHT according to my DHT Test.

well the way Finsteride works is it binds to the Progesterone receptor quite strongly actually and also binds directly to 5 alpha reducatase as normal progesterone also would. when it binds to the prog receptor it will decrease estrogen and DHT siginificantly. issue is finsteride doesn't metabolize into the down stream of hormones like normal prog such as 5aDHP and Allopregnanolone to name a few. finasteride also will convert to Dihydrofinasteride when it reacts with 5AR which has a half life of 1 month so it can be a complete destruction of your endocrine system.

when you hop off finasteride its common to have high plasma DHT which may not even be actual DHT floating around as I have read a theory that it is "ghost DHT" or a false marker and even if it wasn't a false marker DHT is active in tissue more than it is in plasma as most Test to DHT conversion happens in target tissues.

progesterone is one of the main root causes of PFS as that is what finasteride will bind to.

 

[P_stashio]

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[IHateFin]

How has it worked for you man?

it has given me prefin (sometimes better than prefin) dick sensativity and has made me more responsive to exogenous androgens. i also store fat differently again as my face looks much more masculine and my fat around my waste is different and im much leaner. i ran my cycle too long of ru the 2nd time so it didnt progress me the way i was hoping it would, but we were and still are learning what the best way for running ru486 is.

i was able to still improve mybaseline and i do enjoy life and have a sex life with my gf with a libido that does fluctuate, but im currently trying something else out (Randro and inositol) so im waiting to see what new trails show before i decide taking ru again in 2018.

 

[P_stashio]

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[IHateFin]

How did you get the Mediherb Tribulus? Doesn’t it need a prescription etc?

i got it off ebay:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Standard-Process-MediHerb-Tribulus-M1445-40-Tabs-Exp-02-2019/202060679261?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

i hope its legit, but ill find out when it arrives which will be monday.

plus [mention]freeflow[/mention] said he has access to it so you could even see if he could help you get our hands on it.

 

[P_stashio]

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[expendable]

Is putting progesterone cream on your body kind of the same idea as taking ru 486?

Opposite idea technically

 

[P_stashio]

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[IHateFin]

Is putting progesterone cream on your body kind of the same idea as taking ru 486?

well progesterone will agonize your prog receptors which could desensatize them over time which could be good for some, but ru is an antiprogesterone so it wont work the same way. ru will only activate the prog receptors is there isnt any progesterone to compete with, but from what i have read its not full activation of DNA.

 

[IHateFin]

Ok so progesterone cream is giving your body more progesterone which causes a crash but then you feel better?

Isn’t ru 486 also progesterone though

Wait sorry so it blocks progesterone.

So how come some recover one way and others the other way. How do you know?

it could be that prog receptors were too sensative and needed to be down regulated OR it could be that the massive amounts of prog cause a sort of adjustment and compensation for this and when the body doesnt have that extra prog it snaps back, but i honestly am not fully clear on how this works.


ru seems more tried n true as not everyone gets anything out of taking progesterone and some end up way worse once they come off the progesterone. much more risky to try in my opinion.

 

[P_stashio]

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[IHateFin]

They both seem risky this sucks so much lol

1 month in this poison. How to get out of it now.

ru is the least risky man. not one person has taken it and not had something positive to come out of it.
RU is almost the perfect anti-finasteride.
i say almost because at a certain dose threshold ru will become a weak antiandrogen so without this property it would literally be the antithesis of finasteride.

if i were you man i would pick ella or ru and do a super low dose for a few days. 5mg ella seems to be showing great results and id say if you want to be careful go with 10mg of ru for a max of 3 days in a row. this will tank prog immediatly and tank potassium while letting estrogen be dominated by DHT

 

[IHateFin]

its likely our bodies are still cranking out normal amounts of 5 Alpha Reductase, but it keeps getting gobbled up by a progesterone dominance or from diminished androgen receptor densities.

 

[P_stashio]

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[IHateFin]

I hate fin can you take a look at my bloods?

your estrogen is towards the higher end of the range.
SHBG seems lower than i would have figured it would be with estrogen where its at.
TSH seems decently elevated, though in "normal" range.
LH and especially FSH seems super low.

only piece missing is progesterone levels.

its hard for me to really comment on your bloods directly.
progesterone can raise SHBG so its possible that you could have super low progesterone. @5 alpha had really low progesterone readings too so im wondering what his SHBG might have been.

i honestly wish the values were all in ng since im not used to this metric tbh haha

its possible you do need a little jump start to your LH n FSH so clomid may modestly help, but it likely wont cure you since it wont address prolactin or progesterone issues plus the estrogenic isomer will be left in your body once the shorter hal life estrogen antagonist gets metabolized out of your body which could tank your testosterone again by triggering the feedback loop.

this ones a difficult one man as i dont have a ton of info to really give to you based on your bloods, and nothing is sticking out to me that i would identify as a big reason your LH n FSH are so low.

 

[IHateFin]

maybe GnRH is super low so your body isnt being stimulated much to produce Lh and FSH. a GnRH agonist may help like tripto but it will have to be a super low dose like 50 to 100mcg