Most efficient/safest chelation protocol?

[Outlaw]

Whatsup everyone,

It's a bit quiet here but I wanted to post hear to get the opinion of some OG regarding chelation.

My hairtest showed mercury toxicity according to Cutler's counting rules, and my Oligoscan showed crazy high cadmium 2 years in a row (almost at the upper limit). I smoked a ton of marijuana in highschool so maybe it explains the high cadmium. I read one of Helen's post explaining how high cadmium could be a predisposing factor for a PFS crash because it lowers glutathione.

Also, I have always been pretty vocal about substances quickly releasing bile being bad for PFS. Milk thistle has a few stories, but I had one myself with ox bile in 2023 (3 days with half a pill causing a huge crash which took 3 months to stabilize). Same thing happened this year after 2 days of whey (less severely), so perhaps it has more to do with glutathione than bile, I don't know.

Anyway, what would be the most intelligent way to go about it?

Cutler advises rounds of ALA, DMSA or DMPS, and says that urine PH must be managed with cadmium chelation to avoid straining the kydneys. From my readings, Helen recommended long fasts, TEI, fulvic acid, shilajit, pectin and sodium alginate.

I wanna go low and slow, and avoid causing issues. Any ideas?

 

[zancek0]

I think @bruschi11 will be able to answer this one. He's doing something similar afaik

 

[bruschi11]

Whatsup everyone,

It's a bit quiet here but I wanted to post hear to get the opinion of some OG regarding chelation.

My hairtest showed mercury toxicity according to Cutler's counting rules, and my Oligoscan showed crazy high cadmium 2 years in a row (almost at the upper limit). I smoked a ton of marijuana in highschool so maybe it explains the high cadmium. I read one of Helen's post explaining how high cadmium could be a predisposing factor for a PFS crash because it lowers glutathione.

Also, I have always been pretty vocal about substances quickly releasing bile being bad for PFS. Milk thistle has a few stories, but I had one myself with ox bile in 2023 (3 days with half a pill causing a huge crash which took 3 months to stabilize). Same thing happened this year after 2 days of whey (less severely), so perhaps it has more to do with glutathione than bile, I don't know.

Anyway, what would be the most intelligent way to go about it?

Cutler advises rounds of ALA, DMSA or DMPS, and says that urine PH must be managed with cadmium chelation to avoid straining the kydneys. From my readings, Helen recommended long fasts, TEI, fulvic acid, shilajit, pectin and sodium alginate.

I wanna go low and slow, and avoid causing issues. Any ideas?

Please post full oligoscan and testing htma oats bloods hormones whatever u got.

 

[RebelWithACause]

Only do chelation if you have sufficient nutrients in the body. Low level grade chelation like Helen talked about much better for most in my opinion. Which means you support the body even with food/calories while using low amounts of chelators. Which are often even found in food anyways. Think about sulforaphane for example. Or sulfur in general.

If you are very healthy but you are toxic and have good nutrients in the body you can fasting long term or do hardcore chelation.

Most people are very deficient in specific nutrients. Fasting just makes it worse but relieves symptoms temporarily probably by dropping metabolism and detoxification to lower level. That's my assumption.

Just my 2c.

 

[Outlaw]

Please post full oligoscan and testing htma oats bloods hormones whatever u got.

 

[Outlaw]

 

[Outlaw]

 

[Outlaw]

@bruschi11 : the biggest redflag is high Cadmium, which showed up on my June 2023 as well. I don't know how reliable an Oligoscan is for heavy metal toxicity though.

My OAT and HTMA are from 2022 and a lot has changed since so I won't upload them.

Currently working on my gut for the next month to hopefully steer the ship after a big regression since Covid in early November (with new symptoms like fatigue, POTS and exercice intolerance). Afterwards I would like to implement a low dose intervention to adress the cadmium in the background. What would be the safest/smartest way to go about it?

 

[Outlaw]

Only do chelation if you have sufficient nutrients in the body. Low level grade chelation like Helen talked about much better for most in my opinion. Which means you support the body even with food/calories while using low amounts of chelators. Which are often even found in food anyways. Think about sulforaphane for example. Or sulfur in general.

If you are very healthy but you are toxic and have good nutrients in the body you can fasting long term or do hardcore chelation.

Most people are very deficient in specific nutrients. Fasting just makes it worse but relieves symptoms temporarily probably by dropping metabolism and detoxification to lower level. That's my assumption.

Just my 2c.

Yes low and slow in the background is what I'm gunning for, I'm just not sure what to do regarding subtance/dose/duration. Sulfur doesn't cut it, I'm eating a lot.

 

[bruschi11]

@bruschi11 : the biggest redflag is high Cadmium, which showed up on my June 2023 as well. I don't know how reliable an Oligoscan is for heavy metal toxicity though.

My OAT and HTMA are from 2022 and a lot has changed since so I won't upload them.

Currently working on my gut for the next month to hopefully steer the ship after a big regression since Covid in early November (with new symptoms like fatigue, POTS and exercice intolerance). Afterwards I would like to implement a low dose intervention to adress the cadmium in the background. What would be the safest/smartest way to go about it?

Alright we are together in this man.

We have extremely similar body chemistries. I’m sure you’re a lot younger as you didn’t progress as bad as I did with the boron (mine went psycho high).

I have cadmium too. I own oligoscan device so I test every two weeks. But I’m not afraid to test during emergencies.

Cadmium spiked in my last emergency. I came to the conclusion boron toxicity makes vitamin A convert to anhydroretinol which raises peroxynitrate which kills cysteine.

So you can’t detox cadmium.

Gotta fix the vitamin A toxicity first. With liver flushing religiously. Keeping A low in diet. Nothing crazy just don’t eat tons of A .

We gotta get A down the two of us before anything is my take.

I’m putting plan together . It’s literally same approach I’d advise for you. I will write shortly in my fighting log.

Hang in there. We are very similar. We can do this together.

 

[Outlaw]

Thanks for the reply man.

Not sure I understand the whole reasoning, but I just wanna point out in my case, I don't have very high Boron nor vitamin A.

For my case the biggest clues are big crashes from stuff that stimulates liver/bile: B complex, ox bile, whey (via gluthatione). I initially thought it had something to do with an overactive FXR but maybe it's releasing heavy metals and causing a reaction? Or affecting methylation upstream?

I don't know, but I do know these can cause a crash in a mere days for me, which is interesting.

 

[bruschi11]

Thanks for the reply man.

Not sure I understand the whole reasoning, but I just wanna point out in my case, I don't have very high Boron nor vitamin A.

For my case the biggest clues are big crashes from stuff that stimulates liver/bile: B complex, ox bile, whey (via gluthatione). I initially thought it had something to do with an overactive FXR but maybe it's releasing heavy metals and causing a reaction? Or affecting methylation upstream?

I don't know, but I do know these can cause a crash in a mere days for me, which is interesting.

You gotta listen here. Please.

I’ve been doing oligoscans every 6 weeks for 12 months now. And now every 2 weeks. As I own the device .
My entire perspective has changed in this one year time frame with all this data and tying it to my past recoveries.

Boron raises hif1a which makes vitamin A toxic essentially. So A rising anhydroretinil makes too much nitrogen in body. Which opposes carbon—> carbon is cadmium’s biggest antagonist. It’s through active b6 we make carbon (cysteine). Your active b6 is completely dead. Like most with this issue .

Vitamin A really should be in the 50s no higher. I see people with perfect Ceruloplasmin with A at 55. There is no reason to have it that high. It is just toxic raising nitric oxide (nitrogen) that kills carbon (cysteine) needed to control the cadmium problem.

Boron itself is major carbon antagonist borders it on periodic table.

The A/ boron/ cadmium trio is very real. And has to be taken care of. Low chromium happens in this body chemistry which shuts down production of inositol which shuts down iodine absorption so b2 can’t convert to FMN. Fmn= active b6 = cysteine/ carbon!

I can’t write more tonight. Litttle setback today for myself. But it’s clear to me we have to attack this body chemistry for what it is.

 

[merebalacy]

Whatsup everyone,

It's a bit quiet here but I wanted to post hear to get the opinion of some OG regarding chelation.

My hairtest showed mercury toxicity according to Cutler's counting rules, and my Oligoscan showed crazy high cadmium 2 years in a row (almost at the upper limit). I smoked a ton of marijuana in highschool so maybe it explains the high cadmium. I read one of Helen's post explaining how high cadmium could be a predisposing factor for a PFS crash because it lowers glutathione.

Also, I have always been pretty vocal about substances quickly releasing bile being bad for PFS. Milk thistle has a few stories, but I had one myself with ox bile in 2023 (3 days with half a pill causing a huge crash which took 3 months to stabilize). Same thing happened this year after 2 days of whey (less severely), so perhaps it has more to do with glutathione than bile, I don't know.

Anyway, what would be the most intelligent way to go about it?

Cutler advises rounds of ALA, DMSA or DMPS, and says that urine PH must be managed with cadmium chelation to avoid straining the kydneys. From my readings, Helen recommended long fasts, TEI, fulvic acid, shilajit, pectin and sodium alginate.

I wanna go low and slow, and avoid causing issues. Any ideas?

Idk about the counting rules being mercury. I've had a few people on Facebook say that to me yet my oligo shows fairly low mercury, not too low that I am not detoxing anything, but not too high to suggest I'm toxic lol.

Just don't do crazy detoxes with crazy chelators and stuff. Taking it slow like RWAC said will probably be the best bet tbh, go the helen route!

 

[Outlaw]

Idk about the counting rules being mercury. I've had a few people on Facebook say that to me yet my oligo shows fairly low mercury, not too low that I am not detoxing anything, but not too high to suggest I'm toxic lol.

Just don't do crazy detoxes with crazy chelators and stuff. Taking it slow like RWAC said will probably be the best bet tbh, go the helen route!

Yeah tbh I'm a bit lost on how to diagnose heavy metal toxicity, between hairtest and Oligo.

The Helen route would be fasting + sauna + a few chelators among sodium alginate, zeolite, pectasol, fulvic acid and shilajit. But I don't know which one of those would be efficient for cadmium specifically.

I will also start liver flushes. There's definitely a problem there for me.

 

[bruschi11]

Yeah tbh I'm a bit lost on how to diagnose heavy metal toxicity, between hairtest and Oligo.

The Helen route would be fasting + sauna + a few chelators among sodium alginate, zeolite, pectasol, fulvic acid and shilajit. But I don't know which one of those would be efficient for cadmium specifically.

I will also start liver flushes. There's definitely a problem there for me.

It’s gotta be done strategically chelation. To minimize redistribution. And to minimize mineral deficiencies.

I’m putting an approach together for myself . With all of Gbold’s teachings in mind. It’s really not that intricate.

Like liver flush—-> after the oil 24-36 hours of stronger chelators every 8 hours like OSR zeolite. Then another 2-3 days of weaker chelators mcp alginate to minimize redistribution and keep removing stuff.

Then a few days off repeat again. All while giving zinc chromium iodine a little copper . Choline, coq10/pqq, b5, msm.

Symptoms will occur you just gotta learn how to minimize and treat simultaneously. Find the right doses for stuff etc

 

[RebelWithACause]

ALA works pretty well but it's short acting I think. I feel better from it, definitely helps with detoxifying the body. Also took sodiumthiosulfate but I think my low calcium got way worse from it so gave me some problems. But might be good for very slow oxidizer. I also like vegetables with sulforaphane.

I crash on ALA sometimes but it goes away quick if I take another dosage. that's why I think it is shorter acting.

Never tried any of the heavy stuff like EDTA but could be nice if you have OK health. I doubt I could of handled EDTA in my old state would of probably crashed insanely hard