Slow 2, PSSD

[nonsense]

Hi All! I tought I'd put my data here and get everyone's thoughts on what may be a good next step. Brief intro: 28 years old male, took Citalopram between summer of 2015 and May 2016. Tapered off from 40mg over the course of 2 months. I had some sexual side effects on the medication - first delayed then premature ejaculation and ED. Tapered off but never got back to normal. I used to be somewhat hypersexual before the medication. PSSD ever since - ED, PE, soft glans. I do sometimes get morning erections though.

I've posted my results in the PFS thread but thought I'd put here - I have serum values for hormones, hair test, and I did a saliva cortisol test. My progesterone is very high and I have some terrible ratios on the hair test. I at some point got DHT tested as well and it was right in the middle of the range but I understand serum DHT is not very indicative as a test.

I recently started applying magnesium gel to my skin as a test and it seems like I started getting white hairs on my head which I know is something gbolduev mentioned.

Also I started taking Pregabalin and Agomelatine as I went into a deep depression when I realised I may never have my sexuality and personality back. Perhaps the white hairs may be related to that too.

Lastly, I've also had the doppler penis test where they established I have good bloodflow and high testosterone and told me there's nothing they can do for me as it's all in my head. :shock:

I'm considering the Thorne Extra + Resveratrol as hopefully a less risky route to go down. I guess I will have to come off the medication before I do anything though...

Hormones: Have had them tested a few times, pretty consistent
PROGESTERONE * 1.8 nmol/L [0.2 - 0.5] HIGH
Serum prolactin level 157 mu/L [60 - 300]
Serum oestradiol level 139 pmol/L [0 - 190]
Serum testosterone level 32.6 nmol/L [10 - 30] HIGH
Serum sex hormone binding globulin level 39 nmol/L [15 - 55]


HTMA:



Salivary cortisol:

 

[Canari]

Also I started taking Pregabalin and Agomelatine as I went into a deep depression when I realised I may never have my sexuality and personality back.
Lastly, ... told me there's nothing they can do for me as it's all in my head. :shock:

I have studied what is not in medical programs about the autonomic nervous system -ANS-, and they are the ones who put things in people's heads with their words!!!! :evil: I can really get angry with this real aggression that some medical "carers" are practicing!

We are here to prove that many things they say is in the head is just in the body. I answer with a despising joke saying that the head is also in the body.... Use it as much as you would like to use a bow and send this as arrows! :twisted: :arrow:

Words do produce physical shocks of course. And even a depression is not in your head, it is "just" a feeling of helplessness when one do not know how to organize a defense. And believe me, one can be as much overwhelmed as by the inability to defend in a tsunami.... it is the same inside the body at biological level. Anything that fights the word "never" will help the fighting stand up.

 

[nonsense]

It is pretty frustrating. I almost find it funny when I hear the speech about how depression is just like diabetes and SSRIs are like insulin. Seems to be a favourite of psychiatrists. How they go through it with a straight face I'd never understand. Even the textbooks state that there is no direct evidence supporting the monoamine hypothesis of depression. (Stahl's Essential Psychopharmacology)

Any suggestions about what I can try based on these results? I'm trying to follow the forum discussions, but don't have the background to understand and translate into something actionable for my situation. I figured Thorne Extra may be a good start as it covers most of the minerals and I can do with raising most of them except calcium.

 

[Canari]

I still have to go for understanding too! It seems that you can up everything except calcium....
I think high prog correspond to high Zn/Cu.

How is your diet? Have you been peating as they say?

 

[nonsense]

I attempted peating but never really did it properly or for a long time as it didn't feel right. The one key thing I took away from the world of Peat is to try and avoid PUFAs. All my fish oil went in the trash.

My diet is ok, I think. Not perfect, but ok. I eat mostly sauteed vegetables or salads with some sort of protein (chicken, beef, sometimes pork/lamb, trying to add more shrimp) and add more carbs (rice or potatoes) on the days I work out. I often eat eggs. Dairy in the form of yogurt and cheese. Occasionally I eat sourdough bread. Sometimes oats. Avocados and tomatoes almost daily.

My biggest weakness is desserts. I can cook and make a mean Tiramisu...

 

[RedStaR]

I attempted peating but never really did it properly or for a long time as it didn't feel right. The one key thing I took away from the world of Peat is to try and avoid PUFAs. All my fish oil went in the trash.

My diet is ok, I think. Not perfect, but ok. I eat mostly sauteed vegetables or salads with some sort of protein (chicken, beef, sometimes pork/lamb, trying to add more shrimp) and add more carbs (rice or potatoes) on the days I work out. I often eat eggs. Dairy in the form of yogurt and cheese. Occasionally I eat sourdough bread. Sometimes oats. Avocados and tomatoes almost daily.

My biggest weakness is desserts. I can cook and make a mean Tiramisu...

Fish oil is fine, Peat is excessive sometimes.

Blood works rarely tell the story, experiment with low doses of SSRIs and cyproheptadine. Try to snap back.

 

[raven]

Interesting that your Calcium ratios were high, my calcium in general was very high so I'm pretty sure all those ratios will be high too.

 

[nonsense]

I tried cyproheptadine for a few days in April. It didn't have any effect on PSSD for me but it would knock me out for 24 hours so I could not continue taking it and function at work.

I have also tried mirtazapine for a couple of months - no effect on PSSD. Incredible fatigue, sleepiness and some weight gain so I tapered off

 

[alteredhomeostasis]

Hey nonsense, I used escitalopram for a couple of months and ended up with ED and PE, and a few months later a loss of libido and feelings and sexuality. Lately I've been using high dose Saint johns wort and my PE is way better. I take cialis for the ED and it seems to work for 5 or 6 days. Been making a lot of headway with the depression since now i can get good boners and don't bust after 2 thrusts

 

[Shadow]

Hey nonsense, I used escitalopram for a couple of months and ended up with ED and PE, and a few months later a loss of libido and feelings and sexuality. Lately I've been using high dose Saint johns wort and my PE is way better. I take cialis for the ED and it seems to work for 5 or 6 days. Been making a lot of headway with the depression since now i can get good boners and don't bust after 2 thrusts

Im an escitalopram victim too, I recovered like 90% of my boners and libido after using Inositol, still have PE and no feeling... I wanna try SJW but Im afraid of making my tinnitus worse

 

[alteredhomeostasis]

90%??
That's pretty remarkable.
When I took a 20g dose of inositol I woke up 3 hours later with a huge panic attack.. what dose were you at and how long did you take it before you got improvements?

As to the SJW, Is there any reason you think it would make your tinnitus worse?

 

[Shadow]

90%??
That's pretty remarkable.
When I took a 20g dose of inositol I woke up 3 hours later with a huge panic attack.. what dose were you at and how long did you take it before you got improvements?

As to the SJW, Is there any reason you think it would make your tinnitus worse?

I had the same panick attacks and anxiety, was scary! I took it for 8 weeks, had a boost in libido and erection at the 6 week, the it started to fade, then I forgot to buy more and after I dont know, maybe 4 weeks, my libido and erection became much better! BUT as I said, the sensitivity and the arousal feeling are lacking...

About SJW, I read on pssd forum someone talking about visual sensitivity and tinnitus

 

[alteredhomeostasis]

Shadow, only one way to find out amigo. I personally haven't noticed any side effects on the SJW.

Back to the inositol though, how did you take it for 8 weeks if it gave you panic attacks?

 

[Area-1255]

Probably the Progesterone inhibiting Testosterone's brain effects. Namely, get your DHT checked out. Maybe Creatine, Sorghum and some things like that. I've noticed increased muscle hardness and aggression from Sorghum, so it does something.

 

[Shadow]

Shadow, only one way to find out amigo. I personally haven't noticed any side effects on the SJW.

Back to the inositol though, how did you take it for 8 weeks if it gave you panic attacks?

Well I just ignored... after 2 weeks the panic attacks subsided

 

[Minime]

I thought SJW caused PFS-like symptoms(?) Maybe I’m getting it confused with something else.

 

[nonsense]

Thanks guys! I tried SJW for about a month with no effect but I was using the dosage recommended on the packaging. Perhaps I needed to go higher.

Inositol I only tried once - had a teaspoon and proceeded to shit my pants. Did you have any stomach issues with it?

Lastly, @Area-1255 thanks for the suggestion. I had a DHT test with the results below, but I was under the impression that serum values are not very indicative of actual DHT activity. If I remember people were using something like 3adiol-G. Or some ratio that included it. In any case - sorghum is something that I will try. I have often wondered why my testosterone is out of the range high but I have 0 aggression or drive. (not an exaggerration)

Serum 5-alpha-dihydrotestosterone level 1.8 nmol/L [1 - 3]

 

[Canari]

Interesting that your Calcium ratios were high, my calcium in general was very high so I'm pretty sure all those ratios will be high too.

I have this too but prefer to say that my phosphorus and potassium are low!

Fish oil is fine, Peat is excessive sometimes.

What is excessive is to reject berries because their seeds have PUFA! Or some people bother about pufas in their soap before bothering about chemical content.
I think the omega 3 and 6 ratio is important, and I think fatty fish is safer than fish oil.

I ban vegetable oils and butter, and I accept their seeds! Oil maybe should not be separated from the seed. I agree with olive oil, it is medecine! And of course we must burn those fats, not overdo compared to activity. Do not lower calories but up calory expense when you are not tired.

 

[barbaar]

@nonsense If you take inositol on an emtpy stomach that is exactly what will happen in my experience. Just take it with a meal, and spread the dosage so you don't take too much at once and it's totally fine.

 

[Jaxx]

Sjw did give me a 100% window after 2 weeks, without side effects and did the same for others. As with most others, the effects faded after feeling great for a week or so.
Understanding what is causing these windows and why they dont stick might deserve more theory building discussion. @gbolduev @mattyb any idea what happens here? (Higher estrogen, hence lower prog for instance?)